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  #1  
11-04-2015, 04:19 PM
Tamburello Rouge Tamburello Rouge is offline
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Hello. I recently bought a used JVC HM-DH4000U to capture VHS video onto a Macbook Pro. I have about 20 VHS tapes that I would like to capture. Anyway, the JVC has a DV output on the back and my Macbook Pro has a Firewire input. I picked up a cable to connect the two and fired up iMovie. When I try to import the video from the JVC, I can see it listed under 'Cameras' in iMovie, but no video shows on the display and nothing gets recorded. Anyone have any tips for a first timer? Thanks a lot!
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  #2  
11-04-2015, 07:21 PM
sanlyn sanlyn is offline
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The short news is that you're starting with three hobbles that will get in your way and limit the possibilities. The first hurdle is working with video on single-drive laptops with monitor screens that are no competition for a good PC monitor. The second hurdle is the limited video software and formats that can work in a Mac without spending a ton of cash. The third hurdle is capturing noisy analog VHS to lossy DV. Mac users who can tolerate quality loss by capturing VHS to DV can advise you on the limited choices and setup available to you with a Mac. Normally the standard forum recommendation would be to use other methods. But for many people, other methods aren't available. Still, many people successfully mount their old tapes after some work using the method and OS you describe. What you use depends on your expectations.

DV-AVI is PC-only playback. External playback devices, TV, and the internet don't support DV. There are a few choices available for encoding to more universal formats with a Mac, but all of them will involve a second round of lossy encoding from DV-AVI source. Encoding software is available, though, for DVD, BluRay, AVCHD, mp4, etc.

I haven't used iMovie in so long, I don't even recall the interface. But I'm certain a Mac user will be able to solve the problem. But my first guess is that your player won't play analog video thru its DV output.

Last edited by sanlyn; 11-04-2015 at 07:31 PM.
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  #3  
11-04-2015, 09:39 PM
Tamburello Rouge Tamburello Rouge is offline
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Thanks for the response. I am aware of the limitations of the Mac platform in this application. I don't have any PCs and don't plan on buying one so it is what it is.

In terms of format, I only plan to import the videos into iTunes so that I can stream them to my HT. I won't be burning to DVD, BD, etc.

If the JVC does not output a signal the Macbook can see, perhaps I need to add a Canopus box into the chain? Any additional input would be great. Thanks.
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  #4  
11-04-2015, 10:22 PM
sanlyn sanlyn is offline
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Canopus is another product that historically is not recommended by experts in this or several other forums for analog capture, despite Canopus marketing that hails from the days of Pentium-III CPU's. But many pay plenty for Canopus for that purpose and, as you say, it is what it is. One thing you might not be aware of is that noisy VHS captured to DV looks noisier than the original tapes. I don't know that Canopus can cap to QuickTime, but it can encode to MPEG and other formats -- not that they're big improvements over lossless media or DV, but they're more flexible formats.

Last I heard, iTunes doesn't import or play DV. DV is usually converted to QuickTime (.mov) files for iTunes. For any device to play DV, the device must be able to read DV decoding codecs. If a device, network, player, or other streamer doesn't include or recognize a DV decoder, the DV won't play. But I'm pretty sure Mac has a means to convert DV to QT/.mov. It's just been way too long ago that I last used a Mac, which I abandoned after Mac engineers left digital video processing behind for hobbyists and all but gave the field away to Microsoft. Macs used in high-end video today are customized machines with very expensive or custom-designed software.

Meanwhile, I'm now wondering if the up to date Mac experts around here are on prolonged coffee break or going into hibernation for the Fall. Trust me, there are living Mac members among us.
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  #5  
11-17-2015, 02:10 PM
msgohan msgohan is offline
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I doubt iMovie supports the necessary protocol. The Firewire output used for D-VHS machines isn't DV-AVI but rather MPEG-2 Transport Stream.

Cable boxes with Firewire outputs use this same format. I have captured M2TS from a cable box using AVCVideoCap on Mac, so try that. There are a few other utilities that can capture these as well but I found this one to be the most user-friendly.

Having said that, I was unsuccessful when I attempted to capture from my Japanese Panasonic D-VHS machine.

http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/vide...-dh40000u.html
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  #6  
11-17-2015, 03:40 PM
Tamburello Rouge Tamburello Rouge is offline
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Thanks for the replies. I actually have been able to capture video from the JVC using the SDK app AVCVideoCap. The video gets captured as an MPEG-2 Transport Stream file, as stated above. I then use Handbrake to convert that file into H.264 (m4v) file that iTunes can play.

The issue I am having now is that the video has some pretty bad interlacing issues. I need to do some further tests to see where the problem is. These are old yet commercially produced tapes so I'm not sure if it is the source or something in the workflow.
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  #7  
11-17-2015, 04:18 PM
msgohan msgohan is offline
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Quality-wise you're not doing yourself any favours by re-compressing to H.264. If you could play them back in their original interlaced M2TS form you'd be better off.

I guess you're sending them to an Apple TV or something?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tamburello Rouge View Post
In terms of format, I only plan to import the videos into iTunes so that I can stream them to my HT.
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  #8  
11-17-2015, 10:47 PM
Tamburello Rouge Tamburello Rouge is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msgohan View Post
I guess you're sending them to an Apple TV or something?
Yes. That is the primary purpose for the re-encode. The videos will be in iTunes and streamed to my Apple TV for viewing.

I did some testing on the interlacing issue. It's not coming from the source as I connected the JVC directly to my HT display and the picture looked fine, or as fine as 20 year old VHS can look on a 60" plasma. The interlacing problems must be coming from the AVCVideoCap app, I guess. I have attached a screenshot. Does anyone have any suggestions as to what would resolve this? Thanks.


Attached Images
File Type: jpg Screen Shot 2015-11-17 at 8.45.16 PM.jpg (45.6 KB, 10 downloads)
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  #9  
11-18-2015, 09:53 AM
sanlyn sanlyn is offline
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One can't conclude much from a single frame screen capture. Lossy encoded capture of VHS to DV isn't recommended anyway, as DV doesn't interlace that well to begin with and generates digital compression artifacts from analog that aren't easy to deal with. But if you're using a Mac you don't have many choices.

A short clip of a few seconds of motion would be more conclusive.
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  #10  
11-18-2015, 02:52 PM
Tamburello Rouge Tamburello Rouge is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sanlyn View Post
One can't conclude much from a single frame screen capture. A short clip of a few seconds of motion would be more conclusive.
Maybe, maybe not. That screenshot clearly shows the issue I am seeing on the captured video. The edges of the car and cars shadow show some pretty bad interlacing artifacts. The whole video has these around anything that moves. When I hook the JVC directly to my HT display via my receiver, those artifacts are not there.

Either way, I'll post a short clip later this evening. Hopefully more info can be learned from it. Thanks for the help.
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  #11  
11-18-2015, 08:22 PM
msgohan msgohan is offline
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I don't think the Apple TV supports playing interlaced content, so tell Handbrake to deinterlace it. Preferably to 60 fps if your Apple TV will handle that.
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  #12  
11-19-2015, 02:40 PM
Tamburello Rouge Tamburello Rouge is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msgohan View Post
I don't think the Apple TV supports playing interlaced content, so tell Handbrake to deinterlace it. Preferably to 60 fps if your Apple TV will handle that.
I re-encoded the video using decombing and it looks much better. Thanks for the suggestion. I would imagine I could just use deinterlace, as well since it is a VHS source. Also, my framerate settings are "Variable" and "Same as Source". Should I be forcing this to a fixed framerate of 30 or 60 Hz? Thanks again.
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  #13  
11-20-2015, 01:34 PM
msgohan msgohan is offline
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I don't recommend using Decomb for native interlaced content, because the manual states it will use a blending filter for low-motion parts rather than actually deinterlacing it.

For sports/racing footage like this, force it to a fixed frame rate so the auto feature doesn't mistakenly decide to drop it down in sections with less movement. If it was an actual hybrid source that mixes film footage with video footage like the original versions of Star Trek: The Next Generation, variable could potentially work better. (The Apple TV can handle variable fps?) And for movie footage you would usually want to force it to 23.976.
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  #14  
11-20-2015, 02:52 PM
sanlyn sanlyn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msgohan View Post
I don't recommend using Decomb for native interlaced content, because the manual states it will use a blending filter for low-motion parts rather than actually deinterlacing it.

For sports/racing footage like this, force it to a fixed frame rate so the auto feature doesn't mistakenly decide to drop it down in sections with less movement. If it was an actual hybrid source that mixes film footage with video footage like the original versions of Star Trek: The Next Generation, variable could potentially work better. (The Apple TV can handle variable fps?) And for movie footage you would usually want to force it to 23.976.
Good points. If it's movie source it can't be deinterlaced. The owner has to remove telecine or dupe/blended frames to get progressive 23.976. I hear Apple supports only progressive.
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11-20-2015, 03:17 PM
Tamburello Rouge Tamburello Rouge is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msgohan View Post
I don't recommend using Decomb for native interlaced content, because the manual states it will use a blending filter for low-motion parts rather than actually deinterlacing it.

For sports/racing footage like this, force it to a fixed frame rate so the auto feature doesn't mistakenly decide to drop it down in sections with less movement. If it was an actual hybrid source that mixes film footage with video footage like the original versions of Star Trek: The Next Generation, variable could potentially work better. (The Apple TV can handle variable fps?) And for movie footage you would usually want to force it to 23.976.
Thanks for the additional info. The tapes are definitely video based, not film based, so I don't think the 23.976 applies.

It sounds like I want to use the deinterlacing feature in Handbrake. I'll probably use the slowest setting since encode time is not really a concern. Also, I'll set the framerate to a fixed 60 Hz. Thanks again!!
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  #16  
11-24-2015, 09:14 PM
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lordsmurf lordsmurf is offline
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Remember to save your captures as high-quality interlaced video, be it DV, Huffyuv or MPEG-2. Keep those aside as your masters. Then also create a secondary file for playback -- one that can be ruined deinterlaced as required. Because, someday, you'll want better, for hardware and players of the future.

Non-Avisynth (Windows) deinterlacing is generally pretty rotten. At best, maybe Handbrake as a decent Yadif. I know Avidemux does.

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  #17  
11-27-2015, 10:22 PM
msgohan msgohan is offline
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The Handbrake manual does say that its Slow & Slower deinterlacer modes use Yadif.

BTW, the model number is actually HM-DH40000U, not 4000. Can the title of this thread be changed accordingly so that it can be more easily located in future searches?
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  #18  
11-28-2015, 02:39 AM
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Goldwingfahrer Goldwingfahrer is offline
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Quote:
Canopus is another product that historically is not recommended by experts in this or several other forums for analog capture,
sanlyn Post 4

Except the Canopus NX Karte.Capture in YUY2 or Canopus HQ 8-bit [4: 2: 2] or HQX 10-bit 4: 2: 2

See article 548
http://forum.gleitz.info/showthread....er-HDMI/page55

But only on Windows PC.
Mac I have not.


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  #19  
11-28-2015, 02:45 AM
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lordsmurf lordsmurf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldwingfahrer View Post
Except the Canopus NX
He refers to Canopus ADVC boxes.
The Edius cards (NX, etc), and the DVstorm cards, were/are quite nice.
Canopus made lots of good high-end stuff in the early 2000s. It's just that the ADVC boxes were NOT one of them.

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  #20  
11-28-2015, 03:25 AM
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Goldwingfahrer Goldwingfahrer is offline
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Quote:
He refers to Canopus ADVC boxes.
Okay
Yes to the box, ADVC 100/110/300 + ADVC 1000th
I could write much, still have the 110 + 300 + the 1000 here
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