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  #1  
05-18-2012, 02:03 AM
faustine faustine is offline
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Hi everyone...

I know I have countless of questions!

But JaguarPC's VPS offerings are sooo much cheaper than LiquidWeb... and seems they are aggressive in getting new customers..
But how is their webhosting service and their customer / tech support services?
Leaning slightly to JaguarPC.... due to the lower costs...

Thank you.
Regards
Faustine
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  #2  
05-18-2012, 04:55 AM
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Premium vs Budget:

The biggest differnece between JaguarPC and Liquidweb is that JPC is on the upper end of "budget" hosts -- for the purpose of this conversation on managed VPS server -- while LW is a premium host. (In other conversations, for either VPS or other services, sometimes JPC could be considered low-end premium.)

Premium hosts have several key differences to budget hosts:
  • Fewer L1 techs, and more L2-L3 techs, because there are fewer cheap/stupid customers asking them how to install WordPress/etc. So you're often dealing with a very well-trained tech right away.
  • Powerful hardware, with no cutting corners to save money. You'll get RAID-10 SAS arrays on premium grade drives, network-stabilizing appliances on the network, less user density on servers, etc.
  • Commercial software in use, such as Parallels Virtuozzo, VMWare ESX, etc. They're not trying to run purely on top of open-source software, some of which is very inferior to the commercial apps. (I'm not at all anti-open sources, but I consider it stupidity to use crippled tools purely to save money, when the o-s app doesn't truly do what is needed. Sometimes KVM, Xen and OpenVZ is fine, but sometimes it's not.)

Premium Suggestions:

When it comes to mission-critical sites, sites that shouldn't even be down for one hour, then I tend to look at a small menu of hosts:
  1. EuroVPS
  2. LiquidWeb
  3. ServInt
  4. MediaTemple
... and in that order.


Best Location from Asia?

The bigger issue, however, may be in location:
  • EuroVPS is probably too far away from Singapore, and may even route through USA instead of Asia.
  • LiquidWeb is mostly in Michigan, which could be considered Canadian or east coast.
  • LiquidWeb does have an Arizona location, but I'm not sure if all of their services are available there. Ask them.
  • JaguarPC has a Los Angeles location.
  • MediaTemple has a California coast location.
  • ServInt has a Los Angeles location.
Media Temple (mt) or JaguarPC probably best meets your needs, vs LiquidWeb, for the latency -- and probably some degree of site speed.

SolarVPS also has Los Angeles servers, as does Futurehosting. I used Futurehosting for 2+ years, and was pleased. It wasn't entirely without issue, but they have good techs, and were able to either fix them, or provided adequate compensation as an apology (free server time, refunds on monthly costs, etc). They're one of the few hosts I've left simply due to lack of need, as opposed to being crappy. I help admin a server there currently for a client, and it runs nicely.


My Specific Suggeestions for You: (as opposed to generic advice!)

If making a short list for Singapore (or any east coast, Asian, Australian hosting needs), I'd look at these hosts, in this order:
  1. MediaTemple
  2. Futurehosting
  3. JaguarPC
  4. SolarVPS
  5. ServInt
  6. LiquidWeb
__________

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  #3  
05-18-2012, 05:26 AM
faustine faustine is offline
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See ***** with your knowledge! LOL!

At the moment since I'm still pretty new to the concept of VPS... N considering his budget.
I'll get him to consider FutureHosting n JaguarPC for now.
FutureHosting is at which tier? JPC = Lower premium?
and for the bang of buck... in future as well.. best to stick to this 2.

I just can't move off from my livechat need since I'm still new!
its nice to solve simple problems at a snap!

in view of latency, I guess might not consider LiquidWeb now that you have lighten a bulb for me. Anyway their starting plan is too expensive now.
But the fact that its a business site setup.. best there is no downtime or at best min. downtime...

Kindly enlighten again!
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  #4  
05-18-2012, 07:01 AM
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The concept of VPS isn't too difficult...

High-end servers/computers have become so powerful in the past 5-10 years that one machine can outperform a dozen smaller dedicated servers. And those smaller dedicated servers are still able to provide all the processing and storage power needed for most medium-sized site owners -- unlike traditional shared hosting. Using a form of hardware or software emulation/virtualization, an operating system can be fooled into seeing only a portion of the available resources available on a high-powered server.

An emulator is a piece of software that pretends to be hardware, so that more software can run. In the 1990s, emulators were well-known among 486 users who played video games in the 1980s. You could now play NES games on your computer! (And if you knew the proper underground BBS, websites, FTP, or IRC channels, you could download hordes of not-quite-legal game copies.)

Virtualization (aka virtual machines, aka VMs) are essentially a form of emulation.

A piece of software is installed on the server, which allows operating systems to access only part of the CPU/RAM/disk/etc, and install as if it were a real server. (This can get complex, on the topic of isolation, so I'll just skip it for now. It's not too important to you at this point, especially if you're just looking at the hosts mentioned in the thread thus far.)

I would consider Futurehosting to be a premium unmanaged VPS hosting, but middle-grade (not quite premium, not at all budget-grade) for the managed VPS hosting. They've slowly edged towards premium status in the past 4 years, based on my own criteria, and I'll probably rank them as such in 2013 if they continue. One thing that I like about them now is that they deploy a VPS with custom firewall rules already set, and have a pretty decent custom-made client portal for support. (They dumped Parallels BA back in 2008 or 2009, when I was with them.) Those customizations are also what makes a premium host premium.

IMPORTANT NOTE: Given your current skill level, you need managed VPS hosting! (Not unmanaged/self-managed.)
This also means that you'll need to pick a panel. Use cPanel for Linux servers.

I'd give a preference to MediaTemple.
But Futurehosting and JaguarPC are probably both fine second choices.

Stablehost also has VPS plans in Arizona -- worth mentioning. They're not just a shared host.

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  #5  
05-18-2012, 08:28 AM
faustine faustine is offline
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Thanks for your insightful reply again!

Wow you are a walking encyclopedia... *giggles**

MediaTemple's pricing seem on the high side too.... Which at present, we are not considering till he can get people to share the burden of cost.

So are you saying that Futurehosting is better than JaguarPC?

I'm definitely not going into unmanaged VPS.. since I know nuts about Linux much less Linux Server!

JaguarPC's current promotion is tempting! Too bad Futurehosting doesn't have Live Chat to chat with for basic problems.....

Arggh.. Dilemma!
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  #6  
05-18-2012, 08:48 AM
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I think either JaguarPC or Futurehosting would suit you fine. Both are good hosts.

JaguarPC had some issues at their Atlanta datacenter in late April and throughout May, but Los Angeles hasn't had any issues that I'm aware of. The Atlanta issues were not JaguarPC's fault, and they worked with the NOC to get it resolved. A lot of impatient users got all pissy on a few sites, but that honestly is more of a reflection of them and their attitudes, as opposed to the host. That's how it goes with many cheap customers; lower prices yields more rudeness and impatience.

Now if you want to comprehend the price differences, then this is why:

JaguarPC uses either OpenVZ with custom RAM accounting, or Virtuozzo. OpenVZ is an open-source platform with no licensing costs. They have a lot more L1 techs than they do L2 and L3 techs, shifting the staffing costs to the lower end. So advanced ticket support can be slow, and low-level chat/ticket techs sometimes don't know answers. So that's really where the $10 savings comes in. You get about $10 less in support speed. And that's often quite fine.

Futurehosting is using Parallels Virtuozzo and always has techs (sometimes even sales!) available, and generally with decent ticket response speeds. You pay $10-20 more, depending on the plan, to get quicker ticket-based support.

To add yet another host, Knownhost has a California datacenter, too. Their price/quality falls between Futurehosting and JaguarPC.
Personally, I'd pick Futurehosting for support quality, or JaguarPC for low costs.

IMPORTANT $AVING$: Don't forget the coupon codes...
- http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/deal...upon-code.html
- http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/deal...upon-code.html
- http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/deal...upon-code.html ... Note: may or may not work. Just try it.

Quote:
Wow you are a walking encyclopedia... *giggles**
Thanks.

I've just been at this long enough now (15+ years of hosting) to know what's what and who's who. Helping others with hosting is a natural extension of the mission of this site, and then I really hate hearing all the horror stories (WHT and elsewhere) about how a host has destroyed somebody's business. It's so unnecessary, and there are plenty of quality hosts for all needs and budgets.

If you want to support this site:
1. Use our links when signing up for hosts; i.e., Futurehosting, JaguarPC, etc. (The forum auto-links any business that we affiliate with.)
2. Upgrade to Premium Member for $20. Link in my signature, visible to any non-Premium member.
3. Donate a few dollars to support the site. I spend a lot of money each year testing hosts, so people like you don't have to.

If you have any other questions, feel free to ask.
That goes for pretty much anything on the topic of creating/maintaining sites and servers, too, not just the hosting.

Take care.

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  #7  
05-18-2012, 08:53 AM
faustine faustine is offline
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Haha!!

You are making me in a more dilemmic position

Let's see... Now JaguarPC has so good an offer that I can't resist.... and hopefully there are no big problems then.... If we decide to go to JaguarPC

Futurehosting ...... the monthly hosting fees vs the value .... seems a loser when compared to JaguarPC..

Damn!

Choices!!!
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  #8  
05-18-2012, 08:58 AM
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I edited my last post, to add more info, so give it another read.

You're basically having to choose between support speed and squeezing out the lowest price. If this is for a business, your hosting budget should match your phone bill (office, home, mobile/cell, whatever). A lot of people make the mistake of trying to make a month of hosting cost less than the cost of one day's lunch. At $10/month, it's only $120/year, or 33 cents per day, for potentially better support. Think of support/management as business insurance.

Think yet another way: How much business might I lose by choosing to save $10? Therein lies another dilemma.

And while that may seem like I'm suggesting you need to use Futurehosting, it sounds like you're leaning towards JaguarPC in Los Angeles, and I think that's fine, based on your needs (chat) and your budget.

So go get a JPC VPS for yourself.

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  #9  
05-18-2012, 09:10 AM
faustine faustine is offline
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Thanks! Re-read that post too!

Maybe when we are all ready with 2 more sub-account holders to share the cost of the hosting then we'll switch to the better FutureHosting, which seem cheaper than MediaTemple!

Hehe!

Have a great day!
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  #10  
05-29-2012, 01:12 AM
faustine faustine is offline
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Hi there,

I'm already in JaguarPC now, but its really problematic now...

1st few days into it the server is very slow.. and now the emails are down...

What's best is they placed our server in Atlanta DC and not LA.

Any suggestions?

I can't allow the shift to LA now due to the fact that there will be downtime.. but yet again the server is not in exact good shape now. Emails down on and off... servers connection slow on and off... Its making me crazy!

Help!!
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  #11  
05-29-2012, 01:25 AM
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Which specific plan did you opt for?
- Did you get a cPanel managed VPS?
- If so, what are the memory specs? (RAM)

If you're primarily serving Asian traffic, I'd migrate to the Los Angeles datacenter. I wouldn't avoid a strategic move because of potential downtime. There's nothing wrong with downtime when it's done to improve your setup. I don't subscribe to the idea that all downtime is bad -- otherwise you'd never be able to make progress on your sites and server.

I don't recall off-hand which node I'm on, but it's been up flawlessly for weeks.

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  #12  
05-29-2012, 02:03 AM
faustine faustine is offline
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Hi KPMedia

Yes. Its a Cpanel managed VPS

1024MB Ram, does it matter?

Yea, mainly Asian.... I'll get them to migrate tonight, Midnight Singapore time then.... hoping the downtime won't be too long.. my friend needs his emails till before Midnight....

As of now, our CPanel and WHM is slow again... same with the mail server... while I was using his email account to test.. its really slow.....

Was wondering if the downtime will affect emails coming in?
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  #13  
05-29-2012, 11:52 AM
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Downtime will be affected by propagation time. I'd ask JaguarPC to leave the old VPS up for 72 hours, and then check both the new server and old server via IP, and not domain name. I'm assuming POP3 mail here, not IMAP. After 72 hours, quit checking the old IP.

1GB is decent for managed cPanel VPS hosting.

There's really no reason to have email problems on a cPanel server. Consider logging into WHM and customizing which service handles email. See attached image.

If you're using a VPS, it's wise to familiarize yourself with using SSH, as well as commands needed to restart services. While the hosting is managed, it's reactive management (virtually all "managed" hosting is), and you'll have to report errors to get them fixed. Some tasks, however, are so easy that it takes the same amount of time to fix them yourself. It's not the same as shared/reseller hosting, where a host is (hopefully) proactive with their own shared servers.

Another option is to hire a proactive server admin, but that's likely outside your current budget.


Attached Images
File Type: jpg cpanel-mail-config.jpg (61.4 KB, 2 downloads)

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  #14  
05-29-2012, 05:28 PM
faustine faustine is offline
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Well.. shared hosting I encountered are mainly reactive also..

Anyway... I'm so furious.. . they did not migrate for me today!!! When I escalated and even got LIVE CHAT to update the ticket to migrate to LA.... Think next year we'll shift elsewhere! As we already prepaid for 1 year.... Thanks.

As I was typing on this post now, WHM is slow in loading up.... Take minutes... I do hope the LA DC server will solve these slow server issues! Since they did not migrate for me today, had to ask them to re-arrange on the next preferred timeslot -- Midnight Singapore Time.. Damn... Simple english they do not follow.... Sigh.. Thanks for the headsup about the Mail Selection, its already set as Dovecot...

As for the SSH commands.. I'm not really sure how I can get myself familiarise.. as I come from Shared hosting environment. I figured Reseller hosting = Shared hosting environment as per what JPC staff told me.. it will have the same limitations or problems with shared hosting environment?

Anyway, any chance that Future Hosting might have a better promo this coming Black Friday -- Nov ? If have, I think I'll tell my friend to migrate over there instead. .since you said their service is definitely better. (Treat it as an upgrade, but hopefully by that time he has gotten some "customers" to share the cost for his company.)

Wanted to add... Is/Was Futurehosting really that fantastic in terms of their hosting services (reliability) and tech support? However I think we are stuck for 1 year with JPC as they do not allow refunds on prepayment!

So I told my friend, have to wait till next year's Black Friday, if can get better deal, then we'll move.
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  #15  
05-30-2012, 01:54 AM
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I merged your four posts.

Yes, Futurehosting is better for this specific need. It's an upgrade over JaguarPC, in terms of support and hardware. LiquidWeb, MediaTemple or EuroVPS would be better yet, but none of those are in ideal locations (or pricing).

Migrations may requires L2 or L3 techs, and they may only be available during specific hours. To be completely safe, I would also request tasks be done in EST/EDT (eastern time zone, USA, because JaguarPC is based out of Atlanta). Use the timeanddate.com time zone calculator. That's what I do any time I want to schedule something at hosts I use in Europe.

Learning SSH takes time, so just start slow. For example, learn how to login with Putty first, and how to restart Apache.

Black Friday 2011 was lean, and it's usually not super-duper awesome for VPS or dedicated hosting anyway. Shared hosting and reseller hosting tend to get the wacky loss-leader deals. And all of the discounts tend to be one-time only, meaning it wears out in a month or whatever the terms of the sale were. I would let JPC move you, and then just go ahead and monitor the FH sales in late November. (We'll post them here, too.)

Reseller is shared, yes. Same sort of setup. Reseller just gives you access to another panel to add individual accounts. I need to make a map sometime, to help explain this. I'm writing a lot of hosting-related guides right now. I'll add this to it.

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  #16  
05-30-2012, 02:09 AM
faustine faustine is offline
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Thanks!

I wanted to edit but the forum is not receptive

Well I told them 11am Texas Time - Friday, that is the only time my friend is able to take migrations onwards since its just nice Singapore time Midnight, Saturday

I don't really know about whether its better for him to move to Futurehosting due to his budget. I doubt his boss would wanna pay more than what we are paying now. So if Futurehosting can match USD 26 / month or maybe slightly more, maybe than we can consider.

We can only shift next year Nov, not this year.. due to the 1 year locked in (prepayment).... Well not good to subject myself and him to such stress often anyway...

Black Fridays : Usually fall on which day? I forgot.. I have got a good deal with Arvixe last year.. for 2 years plan.. but shared hosting only... $48.. I see your point here.. that most discounts are not that fantastic for VPS / dedicated.

Who knows, if he managed to find 2 clients to share the package with us then it would be easier to shift to Futurehosting by then..... Otherwise... the plan will go to nought.

Add: I'm getting worried now that even the LA DC server will have problems! Currently editing pages in WordPress is a bane as Visual editor is not opening!

Thank you.
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  #17  
05-31-2012, 08:14 PM
faustine faustine is offline
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Hello..

I'm crossing my fingers that their LA DC's Node will not give us problems...

About Futurehosting: There is this Future Engineer Standard option, is this required? Its a payable add on....
Well I'm not sure how my friend would be able to up his budget to get Futurehosting if JPC doesn't work for us.
Or you think I should get him to switch to Futurehosting with the lowest plan, since he doesn't need all that space now... then in future then upgrade to the 50GB space? Is there any upgrading promotion for existing customers?

Just seeking your opinion, in case we need to shift......

Thank you.
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  #18  
05-31-2012, 11:06 PM
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This thread is getting a bit off-topic from the original JaguarPC vs LiquidWeb question, so I'm splitting it ...

Two new posts:
- http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/web-...vps-plans.html
- http://www.digitalfaq.com/forum/web-...ing-pages.html

Continue those topics there.

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  #19  
06-05-2012, 10:59 PM
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Update :

Propagation problems due to bad implementation of a SGNIC registrar.. breaks the continuity of a business site! I had to get my friend to send in a Company Letter to get them to change the IP address of the Nameservers before the site returns.

Other than that, there were some teething problems of the migration, DNS settings not configured properly in the server.
Quote:
The hostname (vps.xxxx.com.sg) resolves to 209.140.20.xx. It should resolve to 209.140.26.62. Please be sure that the contents of /etc/hosts are configured correctly, and also that there is a correct 'A' entry for the domain in the zone file.

The hostname (vps.xxxx.com.sg) resolves to 209.140.20.xx. It should resolve to 209.140.26.62. Please be sure that the contents of /etc/hosts are configured correctly, and also that there is a correct 'A' entry for the domain in the zone file.

Some or all of these problems can be caused by /etc/resolv.conf being setup incorrectly. Please check that file if you believe everything else is correct.

You may be able to automatically correct this problem by using the 'Add an A entry for your hostname' option under 'Dns Functions' in your Web Host Manager.
** Had them solve it, then after some days, the above message returns to haunt us but with the correct IP. Hope after this no more issues with the DNS and the operations of the site. I know nuts about the files stated in that email above... Had to depend on the tech staff to solve it.

LA really seems faster for us compared to the Atlanta node! Hehe!!

But the 1st 2 days after propagation was done, Starting on Monday.. there were some mini downtimes reported by Pingdom... ranging from 10 minute to 30 minutes.... 4 to 5 times a day. Is that an DNS propagation issue or more of their DNS settings not done properly?

Thank you.
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  #20  
06-05-2012, 11:52 PM
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Pingdom isn't always reliable. I got an alert this morning (woke me up) that this site was down, but it wasn't. And I'm using another tool (one one of my other VPS) that I've found to be more reliable than Pingdom, but it's still not immune to false positives. If you want to use a third-party monitoring service, look at SiteUptime. It only checks every 30 minutes for free, but for a few dollars a month, you can check it more frequently. These uptime checkers depend on ICMP packets (pinging a server), and ICMP can be throttled as to not impede the stability of the network. Depending on the method used to detect downtime, including retries and reply lag wait time, you may end up with false positives.

Never assume Pingdom is accurate. Consider it a tool that alerts you to a potential problem, nothing more.

The downtime immediately after a DNS change could very likely be propagation related. I'd wait at least 2-3 days before taking the alerts seriously again.

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