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Originally Posted by EGNL
(I read in the FAQ of DigitalFaq that you can apparently ask for certain people like LordSmurf to answer your questions. So I would appreciate it if they could also provide their answers on this post)
This is my first post on DigitalFAQ.
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Welcome. Hello. Yes, I will answer this.
Replying as I read...
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I recently became interested in digitalizing VHS (PAL, I live in the Netherlands) tapes and tested out Lordsmurf's VirtualDub package with the following setup (summarized):
VCR: JVC HR-S7500
Capture card: WinTV HVR 1250 (on the label it mentions: ATSC/QAM NTSC 79571LF) (it has a Conexant CX23885 chip. I use the S-Video and Audio port)
Codec: Lagarith (lossless)
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That equipment isn't best.
- Ideal is to replace it with better.
- Non-ideal is to salvage the situation.
Your current gear:
- The JVC 7500 is a non-TBC VCR. (NTSC 7500 has line TBC, PAL 7500 has no TBC.)
- That's just a terrible capture card. It's one of the "PVR" style cards from Hauppauge, and was only good for digital antenna (ATSC) recording TV. Not capture analog videotapes.
- No TBCs, neither frame nor line.
- Lagarith can work, but it has well-documented issues with random noise/junk frame insertion, when used for capture.
Huffyuv is the safer choice. (Not
Huffyuv 64, MT, CCE hack -- the original plain Huffyuv.)
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So after reading the "recommended settings for VirtualDub" DigitalFaq post, I took a capture of 5 minutes and there were no framedrops.
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There are settings within VirtualDub that effectively disable dropped frames counters, so I'd want to see a screen capture of your timing settings. In effect, you can ask VirtualDub to lie to you.
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The recording looked decent and I also had cropping on (though some sides still seemed to be yellowish, is that just the Pokemon 4Ever VHS tape being bad?). It seems like the capture card I am using can only capture up to 25 FPS but using the "bob" filter seems to do its job and in most aspects, the "bob" filter makes the video look better. It has been a week since I used VirtualDub so I do not remember in what aspects it did not make the video look better.
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Never on-the-fly deinterlace, it looks bad. You want to capture VHS tapes interlaced, then QTGMC deinterlace post-capture if needed. (And deinterlace is often
not needed, mostly just for Youtube/streaming usage. Even then keep the interlaced capture, make a deinterlace copy for the other use. Never dump the interlaced master file.)
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Regarding the 25 FPS cap, I am still investigating that as I commented on a video of a Youtuber that has the same card but could at least use VirtualDub to capture at 29.33 FPS. I am still waiting for a reaction. Also, it seems like at least two other users (on this forum and on reddit) had a similar issue where there FPS with this card would be capped, though they mentioned 24 FPS.
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It's just a terrible card, you need another. (This is exactly why I have
capture cards in the marketplace.)
Also: Youtube and Reddit is often just random people, so always be wary of advice in those places. Sometimes it's "the blind leading the blind", not a reputable source that truly knows video. Very often, they have as much knowledge as you do, or even less. I run into a that a lot with non-video topics, too.
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Anyway, to get to the point, it seems like there are multiple fake TBCs being 'recommended' on a low budget across the internet. Here are the following I found:
Panasonic DMR-ES10/15
Pioneer DVR-649H-S (but I think just the whole 640 series)
Sony RDR-HXD870
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None of those are TBCs. Those are DVD recorders, with some line TBC passthrough abilities. Panasonic ES10/15 is well known, having strong
and crippled line TBC, with non-TBC frame sync. Pioneer gives mixed results. Certain Sony are often discussed by the user "Bogilein", and his advice is generally good.
The problem with DVD recorders, used as cheap/fake TBCs, is all of them add noise. All of these badly adjust color/brightness/contrast -- and it cannot easily be fixed later in software, if at all.
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So I have a couple of questions; could this fix these yellowish sides I was referring to earlier? I also read that some Fake TBCs have additional settings for tweaking (also something about turning video into "progressive" or something?)
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You never want progressive. None of the DVD recorders (fake TBCs) really have useful settings. It's just a dumb box for passthrough. Signal goes in, signal comes out with TBC(ish) and noise added.
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and I am planning on digitalizing just some Disney tapes (Ducktales), Pokemon tapes and some VHS tapes that are completely in black and white.
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A cartoon collector, one of "my people".
Ducktales and Pokemon are both released, so I would only bother to capture the commercials. Or certain episodes that were banned, censored, or later edited.
I made Ducktales and Pokemon DVDs back in the 00s. Mine are in a cabinet, untouched for at least 10 years now. Several years ago, I ripped the DVDs to ISO my archive DVD HDD -- and don't watch those either. I'm proud of my early work, projects like this, as those are what led me to being noticed by TPTB (the powers that be), and started my accidental video/studio career. But the released versions are much better (both DVD and streaming), excluding any banned/censored/edited episodes.
Re-doing content already available is not worth the effort.
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What "fake TBC" would be recommended for my setup?
Thanks in advance.
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I would defer to Bogilein, and I believe he most suggested the Sony RDR-HXD870. Unlike NTSC ES10/15, the PAL adds excessive luma issues. The Sony does not do that (quite as badly).
Still not a TBC, still not as good as S-VHS VCR line TBC, still no frame TBC. But these "fake TBCs" are better than nothing.
Your proposed workflow = :
- Your S-VHS VCR is decent for a non-TBC unit.
- Sony DVD recorder as TBC(ish) passthrough.
- You still need a better capture card, that Hauppauge you have is awful.
Then you can do decently.
And I want to see your cartoon captures!
