Quantcast KVCD: Notch Interlaced Matrix? - digitalFAQ.com Forums [Archives]
  #1  
12-12-2003, 08:11 PM
incredible incredible is offline
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In case of interlaced MPEG2 encodings where the scan order is based on an alternate order and NOT ZigZag, we still can enjoy the "Notch" filtering.

Here's the modifyed KVCD Notch Matrix for interlaced MPEG2 encodings.
(to be added at the end of the TMPGEnc.ini file within the TmpgEnc folder.

Code:
Name12="KVCD Interlaced"
ReadOnly12=0
Intra12_0=8 10 22 27 29 37 37 40
Intra12_1=9 12 14 28 29 37 39 40
Intra12_2=9 14 27 31 34 37 40 48
Intra12_3=12 22 27 29 34 37 40 58
Intra12_4=26 27 29 34 37 38 48 58
Intra12_5=26 27 29 36 38 38 48 69
Intra12_6=18 27 34 36 38 38 48 69
Intra12_7=26 26 34 34 38 40 58 79
NonIntra12_0=16 20 22 26 28 32 32 36
NonIntra12_1=18 20 22 28 28 32 34 36
NonIntra12_2=18 22 26 30 30 32 36 38
NonIntra12_3=20 22 26 28 30 32 36 42
NonIntra12_4=24 26 28 30 32 34 38 40
NonIntra12_5=24 26 28 32 34 34 38 42
NonIntra12_6=24 26 30 32 34 34 38 42
NonIntra12_7=24 24 30 30 34 36 40 44
Take care of the Matrix counter as this quote from MY TmpgEnc.ini file was the 13th Matrix! And as TmpgEnc starts counting at 0 the counter values in here are "12"!!


- Why should I keep my material interlaced?
It preserves details, will look sharper and the motion will be smoother

- What is about the needed bitrate?
Interlaced encodings do need more avg Bitrate so this is a quality thing if you want to keep streams interlaced choose KDVD as in that case we enjoy enough Diskspace even when authoring 2 Streams to one DVD-R

- What about the difference betwen PAL and NTSC ???
First this matrix is for true interlaced and telecined material. So if DVD2AVI reports that your VOBs are interlaced just be shure by watching some high motion parts, if combing-effects do appear then its in an interlaced state! Only trust your eyes!
Second, in PAL we got in both modes (progressive and interlaced) 25 FPS! That means the same size of effective movie pixel information to encode at BOTH modes.
BUT in case of NTSC you got instead of 23.976 FPS (progressive) 29.976 FPS ! This means MUCH MORE Movie-Information to encode, therefore IMHO as we still want to end up with well compressed files its better to still Inverse Telecine your 29.976 Movies or Captures to 23.976 (progressive)and afterwards applying the Pulldown while play.
So IMHO a real advantage you'll only get when applying this matrix to PAL 25FPS interlaced Streams but not to NTSC 29.976 ones as it will end up in too large filesizes.
But thats only my opinion.


Enjoy

Inc.
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  #2  
12-12-2003, 08:17 PM
kwag kwag is offline
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Thanks incredible
(I've been too lazy to reorder it for alternate scan )

-kwag
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  #3  
12-13-2003, 04:50 AM
Boulder Boulder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by incredible
So IMHO a real advantage you'll only get when applying this matrix to PAL 25FPS interlaced Streams but not to NTSC 29.976 ones as it will end up in too large filesizes.
But thats only my opinion.
I'd say the only material NTSC people might want to encode as interlaced is live concerts. They're mostly quite hard to IVTC if you don't know how to tweak Telecide/Decimate, Force FILM doesn't produce smooth motion at all.

Thanks for the matrix, I've also been too lazy to change the values
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  #4  
12-13-2003, 07:14 AM
kwag kwag is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boulder
I'd say the only material NTSC people might want to encode as interlaced is live concerts. They're mostly quite hard to IVTC if you don't know how to tweak Telecide/Decimate, Force FILM doesn't produce smooth motion at all.
There are clever ways to go down to progressive
http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewtopic....ight=alvinator

-kwag
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  #5  
12-13-2003, 08:28 AM
Boulder Boulder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwag
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boulder
I'd say the only material NTSC people might want to encode as interlaced is live concerts. They're mostly quite hard to IVTC if you don't know how to tweak Telecide/Decimate, Force FILM doesn't produce smooth motion at all.
There are clever ways to go down to progressive
http://www.kvcd.net/forum/viewtopic....ight=alvinator

-kwag
Uh..gives me a headache

Thank God I don't have to deal with that stuff. I only have to live with some crappy NTSC->PAL conversions; Citizen Kane is the worst I've seen, full of blends and ghosting.
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  #6  
12-13-2003, 10:25 AM
incredible incredible is offline
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I didn't read the thread you mentioned until the end sorry (cause right now Im converting some Cannes Advertising Festival DVDs), but the sexyest way to go from real interlaced (not telecined) 29.976 streams down to 23.976 progressive IMHO is by using this:
Code:
Avisource("Your true interlaced 29.976 source here.avi")
Telecide()
convert60ito24p(2,0)
#
############### the function #############
#
function convert60ito24p (clip video, int mode, int offset)
{
work = assumefieldbased(video)
out = (mode==2) ? interleave(
\selectevery(
\layer(trim(work, 1, 0), 
\layer(work, trim(work, 2, 0), "fast"),
\"fast"), 5, 0 + offset), 
\selectevery(
\layer(work, trim(work, 1, 0), "fast"), 5, 3 + offset)) : 
\    (mode==1) ? interleave(
\selectevery(trim(work, 1, 0), 5, 0 + offset), 
\selectevery(layer(work, trim(work, 1, 0), "fast"), 5, 3 + offset)) :
\    (mode==0) ? selectevery(work, 5, 1 + offset, 4 + offset) : work
assumeframebased(out)
}
#################################
See the authors page here:
http://home.arcor.de/scharfis_brain/60ito24p.html
(This function is also shared by sharfis_brain at Avisynth.org)
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  #7  
12-13-2003, 11:00 AM
kwag kwag is offline
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Thanks incredible.
See, avisynth has come a LONG way since that thread discussion by Alvinator
I'm going to post the " convert60ito24p" link on that thread, just in case anyone needs it for references.

Thanks,
kwag
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  #8  
12-13-2003, 11:23 AM
kwag kwag is offline
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Correction. The beginning of the script should read:

Code:
Avisource("Your true interlaced 29.976 source here.avi") 
YourFavoriteDeinterlacerHere()
convert60ito24p(2,0)
.......
-kwag
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