Repair Sony UVW-1200 1400A BetacamSP decks?

[pokeprodbreak]

First of all, thanks to all the users and administrators of this site! What wealth of information about tapes -- really, thank you.

We have a large volume of BetacamSP tapes. I have a Sony UVW-1400A and UVW-1200 with the same problem.
Using the SDI connection and super output from the devices I can get diagnostics to show up on the monitor, but no picture from any tape. No error codes, audio comes in with no issue, all player controls work, but no picture, not on pause fast forward rewind or play. It *seems* when the tape first is inserted and ejected there is about a <1second blip of picture before going back to black screen. The shade of black is such that I can tell it is not reading anything from the tape (or at least not sending that info to the monitor).

Background
The 1400A had worked well for years with regular cleanings only. Recently mid-tape the picture instantly became unusable, with large white lines diagonal through the video. I replaced an auxiliary TBC-28 card in the unit, and this worked for a total of about 60minutes of more tapes, then the picture became all black. I put the same TBC-28 card in the UVW-1200s, it ran for about 7 minutes of tape, then the picture went all black on that unit as well. Swapping the original or another TBC-28 card into the device doesn't seem to make any difference, still just black screen output.

I have also swapped every other auxiliary card in the devices and some smaller PCBs that google led me to, with no changes in the problem -- making sure the part numbers matched in every swap.

The output is the same on component, sdi, or svideo -- black screen. On SDI super output I can get the device controls to show up (time code of the tape, play, stop lock words, etc.) on the monitor.

Questions are:
* where would I begin to look for issues, and what would those issues look like?

* What device inside the unit is actually 'seeing' the video? I'm unclear on how exactly this works, but I seem to get a blip of video (or even just black color change) when loading and ejecting tapes -- seems worthy of investigation?

* Though it is not my expertise, there do not seem to be blown capacitors or other visible issues on the TBC-28 card or other circuit boards, at least those on top. Looking for bulged, distorted, or discoloration residue on the board itself...?

* is it possible I suffered drum failure on both machines near-simultaneously, and would drum failure look like this (from picture to Zero picture, all of a sudden)?


I've never replaced a circuit board capacitor or done fine soldering but did used to assemble a lot of custom PCs, and am willing to learn whatever makes the most sense, much appreciated any advice towards this end. All best

[lordsmurf]

Welcome.

I'm about 15 years removed from any BetacamSP, so I won't be overly useful here. I just wanted to say "welcome", and add a few quick comments.

Almost all analog-era gear is now at least 15 years old, most of it 20-30 years old, some of it as much as 40-50 years old. It needed maintenance to survive, and pretty much everything now required repair/refurb. There's no way to escape it anymore.

You've already tried the simple(r) swap method, so now you've graduated to the teardown/solder steps.

To answer some questions:
- #1 step is always acquiring the service manual.
- caps are often not visibly damaged, each must be tested with tools/meters.
- drum failures happen with anything using drums, but both machines having drum failures is less likely

Others here have more recent experience with this format, so I leave you to them.

[aramkolt]

Clogged heads or tape tension issues could cause the problems you are describing, as could certain bad capacitors which often won't have any outward appearance of being bad. The odd thing is you have two different machines that are doing similar things, so it could be a common problem that develops if they sit unused for a while maybe like dried up lubricant or bad capacitors. The tapes themselves could have a problem like having been fully or partially demagnetized by something, but that's rather unlikely.

I'm not super familiar with the 1200 and 1400, but I have worked on UVW-1800's which I'd imagine is similar, though I don't think the 1800's I worked on had major issues.

It does look like many of the 1800s on ebay don't power up at all which might suggest that the power supplies in these have capacitors that like to go bad, so you could be missing a voltage coming off of that required for playback maybe.

I will say that the UVW series isn't considered top of the line as they lack dynamic tracking and just weren't as high end of units when they were new. Best units I've heard are the BVW and DVW, and HDW-M series, but on a budget, I'd probably seek out an 1800 since they can be had quite inexpensively, often $150 or less including shipping, though in most cases it'll probably be untested at that price. Shipping your decks back and forth for someone to look at could cost around that just in round trip shipping.

Maybe post a few pictures of the inside of the unit and a short video of the tape playing from the inside.

I'm guessing you already have a good idea that the tapes themselves are good, but if you want to send me a few, I can verify that they do play ok on working machines for basically just the cost of return shipping. I also do have some fully serviced working machines I'd consider selling and if you're interested, PM me.

[pokeprodbreak]

I had always cleaned the drum and tape path with a cotton swab. Seeing some comments about sandpaper on the head for cleaning purposes (which sounded terrifying) I met in the middle with notebook paper soaked in rubbing alcohol. This was held stationary and tight while spinning the drum slowly, paying careful attention to get the heads. Voila, video! And yes, embarrassingly, this did work on each of the machines with the original issue.

However, it wasn't even 5 minutes (and a clean tape) before same issue again, each machine (one lasted a little longer). The same notebook paper in alcohol worked but, again, not for very long. Would a conclusion of head (drum?) failure make sense here? I was pretty firm with the notebook paper, or so I thought - after the first cleaning or two nothing was visible on the paper. I have not investigated with a microscope or anything. Everything looks fine on the inside, compared to when stuff is obviously broken.

At what point do I damage the heads by cleaning too hard and could they ever 'come back to life'? Or maybe the same tape damaged heads in both machines?

#1 step is always acquiring the service manual

-- Did this. Useful but now I want more out-of-service-life tools ...

caps are often not visibly damaged, each must be tested with tools/meters
--How reasonable is it to expect repair of the circuit boards in these machines. So many parts are non-capacitors...can it be done? I have a known bad expansion card that I would love to repair but don't know where or how to look.

- drum failures happen with anything using drums
I finally learned the heads are in those tiny slots on the drum. Presumably they would get replaced as part of the drum?

--The tapes themselves could have a problem like having been fully or partially demagnetized
I have noticed seemingly random tapes with problems, stored in the (exact) same conditions as tapes with no problems. See example video for this. Maybe 30 years ago someone left it on a monitor or...? Is there a way to rehabilitate a tape like this?

BVW and DVW, and HDW-M series

some fully serviced working machines
I would love these. when the budgetary stars line up.

[timtape]

Certainly your playback decks need to be in excellent working condition. Video tape machines are complex.

Unless abused Betacam tapes are unlikely to have have lost their magnetic signal. Parts of the color bars on your brief sample are fine, suggesting demagnetization is not an issue. But physical tape damage, dirt or contamination are other possibilities. Magnetic tapes can be cleaned. Some are easier/safer to clean than others.

Please note: Some Betacam tapes had binder issues and for decades have needed special heat treatment BEFORE attempting a play. Playing them without treatment will very quickly contaminate the heads, drum and tape path generally. These binder issues are mostly not an issue with VHS, Betamax, 8mm, DV etc tapes.

Do you know about these binder issues? You may need to seek advice from Peter Brothers, a long recognized world expert. The paper below from his website refers to the problem re UMatic and Betacam cassettes.

http://www.specsbros.com/white-paper...cassettes.html

[pokeprodbreak]

Yes, binder issues I am a little bit familiar with from Umatic tapes.

From what I understand the sticky shed issue is only when the tape struggles to play or doesn't spin freely. Could the SSS or binder issues be obvious from some other symptom too? Also, that issue would almost always be obvious from a bunch of residue left inside the machine...right..?

I have baked Umatic tapes in an oven but remain unclear if the same thing would be useful for Betcam SP tapes. They are made of the same materials that can trap moisture over time? With some time, I'll do a little more research...

The deck has an indicator that is supposed to light up when there is an 'oxide' tape (per the manual), and it does light up sometimes, but on seemingly random tapes. I am only dealing with Betacam SP tapes in this scenario.

Is there any reasonable way to clean a betacam SP tape without some sort of advanced cleaning machine? Would the residue be visible to the naked eye either on the tape or on the cleaning materials?

thanks

[aramkolt]

The sample looks like dropouts/head clogging to me which explains why your machines are both doing it after the tape has been going for a few minutes after cleaning the transport. This is of course presuming that the tape doesn't appear physically crinkled/damaged when you look at it as a chewed tape will appear similar during playback. I've done U-matic tapes where they'll literally clog in 1 second or less after cleaning the heads and there really isn't much you can do other than bake the tape and ideally physically clean the tape. Sticky shed doesn't have to make the typical "sqealing" noise when played in the player.

I don't really know what Spec Bros do for their cleaning process, but I assume it includes passing the tape over a dry or alcohol dampened cleaning pad several times which is what an RTI tapechek machine would do. I've heard of submersion cleaning where the tape is physically submerged into a liquid for a time and then I assume is wiped or blown dry as it exits the fluid and is slowly spooled.

As far as cleaning machines, that will depend on whether your tapes are the "full size" tapes or "betamax" size tapes as I am unsure if the more DIY cleaners are physically large enough to handle full size tape hubs. If they are the smaller betamax size, you might be able to get away with a modified tape rewinder with light application of PEC pads that are dampened with alcohol or I've seen some use spinning rollers.

The more mainstream cleaners like the VHSisLife machine and several knockoffs can be found in the $90-$120 range. I think the issue with the VHSisLife version is that they are often sold out as there's quite a waiting list generally. I do have a VHS is life machine myself and I would recommend it as the 3D prints are quite high quality. It'd be nice if the cleaning guides weren't fixed in position, but it'll work for most use-cases. Not sure about full size betacam tapes physically fitting on there though.

The knockoff I've seen here is less expensive and available, but I'd still spring for the VHSisLife machine if budget/time wasn't an issue: https://www.ebay.com/itm/405885297957.

The knockoff looks even less likely to hold larger tape hubs, so that might again be a no go if you have full size tapes anyway.

You could also make your own machine using a betamax rewinder, not dissimilar to this. If budget is the primary issue and you like to tinker, you could make something like this: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/2aZd5HMtJtQ

If it's super important content, then I'd probably recommend having someone do it that is used to cleaning tapes, but that will certainly not be budget friendly as it is a very time consuming and tedious process.

[timtape]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokeprodbreak

Yes, binder issues I am a little bit familiar with from Umatic tapes.

From what I understand the sticky shed issue is only when the tape struggles to play or doesn't spin freely. Could the SSS or binder issues be obvious from some other symptom too? Also, that issue would almost always be obvious from a bunch of residue left inside the machine...right..?

I have baked Umatic tapes in an oven but remain unclear if the same thing would be useful for Betcam SP tapes. They are made of the same materials that can trap moisture over time? With some time, I'll do a little more research...

The deck has an indicator that is supposed to light up when there is an 'oxide' tape (per the manual), and it does light up sometimes, but on seemingly random tapes. I am only dealing with Betacam SP tapes in this scenario.

Is there any reasonable way to clean a betacam SP tape without some sort of advanced cleaning machine? Would the residue be visible to the naked eye either on the tape or on the cleaning materials?

thanks

Classic SSS symptoms are initially squealing, slowing, and loss of picture and sound due to spacing losses (tape muck on the heads, drum and entire tape path).

Again, we dont play affected tapes. We first bake them in the recommended oven type for the recommended temp and times, and sometimes longer.

If a tape has already been played in a deck, we thoroughly clean the affected deck's tape path, which can sometimes be quite a job and shouldnt be rushed. Cleaning the stuff off thoroughly without damage to the deck can be tricky. It requires practice, and the right materials.

The sign that a tape has been baked enough is only known after it has been successfully played all the way through with good picture and sound, and there is no residue on the deck's tape path. The deck's tape path is still very clean. If needed we rebake and try playing again.

Did you check the Specs Bros site photos and descriptions to see if any of your tapes are likely affected?

[pokeprodbreak]

Quote:

Originally Posted by aramkolt

You could also make your own machine using a betamax rewinder, not dissimilar to this. If budget is the primary issue and you like to tinker, you could make something like this: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/2aZd5HMtJtQ

this is probably my most likely avenue, someday. Although I'm not sure dirty tapes is really my issue it seems like a good best practice. I use a separate machine for rewinding Betacam tapes as it is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by timtape

Again, we dont play affected tapes. We first bake them in the recommended oven type for the recommended temp and times, and sometimes longer.

This has definitely worked for me with Umatic tapes. The way I've identified the problem cassettes so far is gently spinning them by hand and feeling the resistance. Presumably there are better methods...I have yet to do this with a BetacamSP tape, and am wondering if it would ever be beneficial.

Quote:

Originally Posted by timtape

Did you check the Specs Bros site photos and descriptions to see if any of your tapes are likely affected?

Yes! None of the BetacamSP tapes show any of the warning signs, though I have read through that site.

For the record I have pretty much written off this issue to damaged or worn heads and am wondering if there are more ways to verify that. What would I see under a microscope or magnifying glass if I were to look at the heads? Here's the issue, more straightforward, and the tape is a Betacam SP tape:
* A UVW-1200 and UVW-1400A and known working tape, after 5 minutes or less of play time, the picture quickly drops out (sometimes going black and white first, usually with a second or two of 'pixellation')
* After what I would consider an 'aggressive' cleaning holding alcohol soaked notebook paper against the drum during rotation, I can get another couple minutes of playtime. Maybe importantly, there is no *visible* residue on the paper after these cleanings (although there was the first time I used this technique), or anywhere else in the tape path.
* The tape works well in another (3rd) machine.

Could this mean the heads are failing or have failed, and is there any sort of adjustment or rehabilitation I could consider? Maybe there was a particle in the tape that damaged or scratched the heads? Maybe I'm holding down on the notebook paper too hard and messing up the position of the heads, if that's possible?

thanks

[aramkolt]

Worn heads will not improve after tape path or head cleaning, so I don't think that's the issue here. That, and you aren't seeing residue left behind on the cleaning paper, so if it really does play perfectly fine on another machine, it's likely not sticky either. The odds that you have two decks that have similarly worn heads is also kind of unlikely. The UVW1200 and 1400 probably do have an hours counter that you can bring up, I know the 1800 does. Usually it's some combination of the menu button plus one of the arrow buttons, but it'll be in the manual.

Since the tape does work well in another machine, it could still be a tape tension problem, but I don't know why the tension would vary after a few minutes unless a pivoting arm on a spring has lubricant or if there's some type of electronically controlled tension applied and there's a problem with that pathway.

Alignment and tracking could also be a factor, but again, not sure why that would degrade after a few minutes of play.

If you, clean the tape path, turn the machine on and leave it on for 15 minutes, then go to play a tape, does it immediately have the issue, or is the 5 minute thing from turning it on from cold? If it's just based on how long the machine has been on, then it is almost certainly an electrical problem.

A video of the tape playing in the machine just as the machine starts having the issue again could be helpful.

[lordsmurf]

Yes, you can overclean heads, which leads to wear. That's why the "clean the heads" advice is often wrong and ridiculous, because it's not a fix-all for whatever ails the deck. Done wrong is bad, but done too much is also bad.

[radiokom]

Quote:

Originally Posted by timtape

Classic SSS symptoms are initially squealing, slowing, and loss of picture and sound due to spacing losses (tape muck on the heads, drum and entire tape path).

Again, we dont play affected tapes. We first bake them in the recommended oven type for the recommended temp and times, and sometimes longer.

If a tape has already been played in a deck, we thoroughly clean the affected deck's tape path, which can sometimes be quite a job and shouldnt be rushed. Cleaning the stuff off thoroughly without damage to the deck can be tricky. It requires practice, and the right materials.

The sign that a tape has been baked enough is only known after it has been successfully played all the way through with good picture and sound, and there is no residue on the deck's tape path. The deck's tape path is still very clean. If needed we rebake and try playing again.

Did you check the Specs Bros site photos and descriptions to see if any of your tapes are likely affected?

I have no experience with video tape baking, but for audio tapes I prefer food dehydrator (very few tapes in Europe suffers from SSS because BASF never used polyurethane binding, only AGFA sometimes). Works perfectly. I doubt there are baking technical bulletins for video tapes so it could be try and error method. But for start those for Ampex audio tapes can be taken.

[pokeprodbreak]

Bumping this thread a little bit, because I've found lots of answers to lots of problems -- but there is one that I can't seem to track down..

What could potentially cause the problem in attached videos? They are sourced from different Betacam tapes.

It is similar to the original sample video I posted up-thread. The problem is unaffected, or in some cases made worse by tape baking. My closest lead says that the tape is stretched out and needs to be re-tensioned (?)...

Context: The problem exists on certain batches of Betacam (more often 'regular' and Not BetacamSP) tapes. It is reproducible with negligible or no differences across players. Much more frequent with the smaller half-size betacam tapes. Seems to have more to do with the age of the tape than the brand of tape, but there could be other patterns I'm missing.

Possible cures that I've tried: "re-spooling" the tape; as in fast forward rewind all the way. Would playing the tape all the way through as opposed to fast foward spool it at a different tension? How many times should this be done? I've tried up to two times with no noticeable results.

Other issues previously in thread: Thanks everyone for the good advice. What I've discovered is that worn heads seem to get dirty much faster...I've become a bit more familiar with the UVW 1200/1400 machines over time.

Any insight on what could be causing the problem seen in this footage (with the 'same' problem visible in last video clip) would be much appreciated. Is there any hope to get tapes like this playing properly? Thanks

[aramkolt]

What you're seeing there is just the dropout compensator showing "line repeats" as opposed to showing "static" or "random noise" when there's line dropouts or dirty heads. The "severe" sample is almost certainly dirty heads since it continues on every frame. If the tape looks physically damaged in that spot or is sticky and baking hasn't helped, the next step would be a physical cleaning of the tape using something like a VHSisLife machine if you're on a budget using betamax spindles (since they are the same). I'm not sure if it can accommodate full size betacam tape hubs though as I've never tried them.

For even less cost, you could also try physically cleaning the tape as you FF/rew the the tape through the machine with PEC pads pressed up against the tape, but you do risk damage to your machine, especially since most betacam machines do their FF/REW in a fully loaded position with the tape all the way around the drum. Where the damage could occur is if the pad gets sucked into the drum if you happen to let go of it. If the tapes happen to be the small case type, you could potentially use certain betamax players from Sanyo that DON'T FF/REW with the tape fuly loaded onto the drum or a betamax rewinder that has been modified to have PEC pads pressed up against the tape as it FF/REW the tape.

There's some evidence that playing a physically damaged tape over and over actually does reduce the number of dropouts, likely by smoothing out wrinkles and perhaps the plastic side of the tape gets polished by running over the drum and runs smoother on subsequent plays. If the tape is sticky, more plays is unlikely to be helpful and continues to risk damage to the machine. Some machines have a sapphire burnisher which precisely scrapes debris off of the tape right before it makes it to the head which could help with dirty or sticky tapes potentially, not sure if the 1200 or 1400 does. The 1800 I have and all of the dynamic tracking machines do have this burnisher.

The only other thing that might help would be a betacam player with dynamic tracking (these are higher end machines), though most people wouldn't want to risk damaging a machine by putting a known sticky tape through it if that happens to be the issue.

How many tapes actually have these issues and are they the full size tape or are they the compact ones that are like regular betamax size?

Also what was your specific baking procedure used?

[latreche34]

Ah those dreaded tape dropouts, remind me of the TV broadcasts from back home back in the day, I remember one of the TV techs mentioning in recent years that they use the shit out of those tapes before replacing them, That's how expensive tape media were back then.

[pokeprodbreak]

Thanks!

I was reading somewhere earlier about tape dropouts, but the crux of that article was how to fix them afterwards. Would love to find a way to get takes at least partially better before I get into that...

Yes the sony 1200 and 1400A both have the scraper/cleaner in the path and regular amounts of tape are cleaned off that. I do like the idea about the holding the pad or I could possibly modify one of the posts in a different machine to press a PEC pad up against as it goes by. I'm wondering if that's worth a shot, even though there's no visible debris left on the drum, heads or anywhere in the tape path after running these tapes?

For baking betacam I remove the top half of the shell (half with the flap) and most of the mechanics of tape enclosure stay in place, much easier to put it back together. I didn't have great results leaving the enclosure totally sealed. I leave everything in place then bake at 52C generally but have also been closer to 54C some runs, usually 14 hours (of the tapes at that temperature). This works well for mostl umatic tapes (some need much more time) I've encountered and a few betacam tapes that have signs of SSS (all red half size ones, ampex I think).

However, for each of the tapes in the short video, the issue is far more noticeable *after* the tape was incubated.

Out of a collection of <many> tapes, so far I have run into this mostly with the smaller half size cassettes. No physical damage or debris is visible inside, out, or in the tape path after they're played. I clean the drum/heads generally with lined paper soaked in alcohol and cotton swabs where it's hard to reach.

What sort of physical damage to the tape could cause these dropouts, 20-30 years later? Dropped too many times? Debris? Exposure to magnetic field somewhere along the way?

Is it realistic that something like this could be remedied with dynamic tracking? I know that's a whole other series of machines for betacam.

What issues can I be looking into other than sticky shed syndrome?

[radiokom]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokeprodbreak

even though there's no visible debris left on the drum, heads or anywhere in the tape path after running these tapes

Visible debris? If you see visible debris your machine need general maintenance. If heads are dirty you will not see it with bare eye. Did you cleaned them with paper soaked with IPA (properly)? Those heads what is in drum

[pokeprodbreak]

Hopefully, yes. I soak the the paper in alcohol hold it firmly and gently spin the drum. Generally you can see if the paper is discolored, it got something. If it's held under the light and there's no change I had figured the heads were pretty clean. Makes sense that there would be more getting removed that isn't easily seen.

[radiokom]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokeprodbreak

Hopefully, yes. I soak the the paper in alcohol hold it firmly and gently spin the drum. Generally you can see if the paper is discolored, it got something. If it's held under the light and there's no change I had figured the heads were pretty clean. Makes sense that there would be more getting removed that isn't easily seen.

Be careful, you do not need to clean drum to death. But you can try, when your finger with paper is on particular head, slightly move drum in both directions and then follow to next head and do the same. Very gently but you should feel a head under your finger.

[aramkolt]

Are these betacam regular or betacam SP tapes? SP is technically a "metal" tape and it has been suggested that it is possible for some types of dirt to chemically fuse to the heads and that may possibly not come off with just the paper and alcohol method. Same is true for DV tape, U-Matic SP, and several of the digital8 formulations. For those, you may actually need a cleaning tape which is mildly abrasive. Technically the paper method is also mildly abrasive.

It's a bit odd that the issue is worse after baking, I'm not particularly familiar with that phenomenon, but it could be that baking affects the impregnated lubricant in the plastic portion of the tape that contacts the heads.

Another school of thought is that lubricant within the plastic tape can dry out and that re-lubricating may improve playback. At one point, I had a link to a PDF that talked about recommending re-lubrication of basically all vintage video tape formats as it causes less wear to the playback machines and the tapes, but they weren't specific about the method itself. Some transfer companies will say that they lubricate the surface of every tape, but they typically won't tell you what is used. You might be able to use something like an electronic grade silicone lubricant found in some electronics contact cleaners like MG Chemicals 404B.

While I don't really approve of the actual capture methods used by Got Memories on YouTube, he does show in several of his videos using contact cleaner on moldy tapes and it apparently does not cause any immediate/significant harm. I wouldn't test it on anything that rare or important, but might be an interesting test to do if you've got an unimportant tape that has the issues you are seeing. I'd imagine the actual application would be via PEC pad as the tape passes by on a few FF/REW cycles (you'd only apply it to the side of the tape that contacts the video head) and then maybe a dry run.

All theoretical of course and something you'd be doing at your own risk.