VirtualDub video standard, frame rate?

[WestRGB]

I am new to VirtualDub, so please forgive my inexperience. I'm having an issue where I cannot set the correct Video Standard or Frame Rate in VirtualDub. In following tutorials on this forum and seeing screenshots of other folks' settings in VirtualDub, I realize mine looks different.

Some examples:

1. Under Video, when I hover over Video Source, there is a greyed out text saying "No video sources"

2. Under Video, when I click on Capture Pin, beside Video Standard reads a greyed out text saying "None." The frame rate is set to 25fps. When I try to change it, it changes back to 25.

3. Under Video, when I click on Capture Filter, there is a window with 2 tabs: "Video Proc Amp" and "Camera Control." There is no tab for Video Decoder as I see in other tutorials online.

4. Under Capture, when I click on Settings, a window comes up that looks different from others I see online. There are no tabs, and only 2 selections: "Wait for okay to capture" and "Frame rate." The frame rate here is set to 30fps, and again cannot be changed.

When I try to Capture AVI and select Preview, I see the video playing but the colors fluctuate wildly. I suspect the program is ingesting my NTSC tape as PAL. But I can't seem to change any settings in VirtualDub to fix this.

I've tried VirtualDub versions 1.9.11 and 1.10.4 and VirtualDub2, all with the same results.

My workflow is very poor right now. I only set it up to acquaint myself with the software in anticipation of receiving a professional workflow. I'm using the following:

Cheap Sony VCR --> UCEC USB 2.0 Video Capture Card Device --> VirtualDub on Windows 10.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated

-West

[kadabra]

Quote:

Originally Posted by WestRGB

1. Under Video, when I hover over Video Source, there is a greyed out text saying "No video sources"

2. Under Video, when I click on Capture Pin, beside Video Standard reads a greyed out text saying "None." The frame rate is set to 25fps. When I try to change it, it changes back to 25.

3. Under Video, when I click on Capture Filter, there is a window with 2 tabs: "Video Proc Amp" and "Camera Control." There is no tab for Video Decoder as I see in other tutorials online.

Hey, did you manage to solve this? I have the same problem as you above, except for that I only see one tab; the "Camera control". Tried with both 1.9.11 and 1.10.4 on Win 11 with an "Easier cap" USB grabber. Also I'm not able to change resolution to anything else than 480x320 even though it says 720x576@25FPS (PAL) on the packaging.

-- merged --

Ah, nevermind I guess - looks like it's the capture card that is the problem :/

[WestRGB]

Hi kadabra, I can confirm the capture card was the problem. As soon as I got the correct capture card (in my case, a Pinnacle 710 USB) the issues went away.

[kadabra]

Big thanks for your reply to my bump.

After my post I had a hope that I somehow might have installed the wrong drivers, at least ChatGPT sees that as a possible cause of the above problem. But that's probably a long shot after all...?

Were you satisfied with the Pinnacle 710-USB? I suspect though that there are probably even better alternatives now in 2025 (I'm running Windows 11).

[WestRGB]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kadabra

Big thanks for your reply to my bump.

After my post I had a hope that I somehow might have installed the wrong drivers, at least ChatGPT sees that as a possible cause of the above problem. But that's probably a long shot after all...?

That is certainly a possibility. Though I wouldn't necessarily trust ChatGPT to diagnose your issue. There's likely someone on this forum (smarter than me) who might be able to assist. Or better yet, consider reaching out to the individual who sold you the capture device.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kadabra

Were you satisfied with the Pinnacle 710-USB?

Yes, I was satisfied with the Pinnacle 710-USB.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kadabra

I suspect though that there are probably even better alternatives now in 2025 (I'm running Windows 11).

To obtain the absolute best possible quality from a VHS tape in 2025, The Domesday Duplicator and VHS-Decode are your best options. However, I would avoid researching those topics on DigitalFAQ -- lots of misinformation on that subject on these forums. Best check out the official Github.

However, VHS-Decode is not for the faint of heart. If you're a layman without experience soldering or coding, VHS-Decode may be a bridge too far for you. Is it the best? Yeah. But conventional capture methods will still get you 95% to 99% of the way there. It's really a question of how much time, energy, and money you want to pour into your project.

[lordsmurf]

Quote:

Originally Posted by WestRGB

I am new to VirtualDub, so please forgive my inexperience. I'm having an issue where I cannot set the correct Video Standard or Frame Rate in VirtualDub.

I think ChatGPT was actually correct (always a first for everything!), and you simply did not have the current codec installed. Maybe.

Quote:

1. Under Video, when I hover over Video Source, there is a greyed out text saying "No video sources"
2. Under Video, when I click on Capture Pin, beside Video Standard reads a greyed out text saying "None." The frame rate is set to 25fps. When I try to change it, it changes back to 25.
3. Under Video, when I click on Capture Filter, there is a window with 2 tabs: "Video Proc Amp" and "Camera Control." There is no tab for Video Decoder as I see in other tutorials online.
4. Under Capture, when I click on Settings, a window comes up that looks different from others I see online. There are no tabs, and only 2 selections: "Wait for okay to capture" and "Frame rate." The frame rate here is set to 30fps, and again cannot be changed.

Then again, that seems like drivers. What capture card are you attempting, and what drivers?

Quote:

Cheap Sony VCR --> UCEC USB 2.0 Video Capture Card Device --> VirtualDub on Windows 10.

Ah, yeah, garbage capture card. Very likely here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kadabra

with an "Easier cap" USB grabber.

Same as above, cheap Chinese (Temu/Wish/Aliexpress/Amazon/eBay) junk capture card.

Quote:

Ah, nevermind I guess - looks like it's the capture card that is the problem :/

Yep.

Quote:

Originally Posted by WestRGB

Hi kadabra, I can confirm the capture card was the problem. As soon as I got the correct capture card (in my case, a Pinnacle 710 USB) the issues went away.

Yep.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kadabra

Big thanks for your reply to my bump.
After my post I had a hope that I somehow might have installed the wrong drivers, at least ChatGPT sees that as a possible cause of the above problem. But that's probably a long shot after all...?

I think it's actually both here. Codec, and drivers.
- Is Huffyuv installed correctly?
- Drivers? Assuming good capture card.

Quote:

Were you satisfied with the Pinnacle 710-USB? I suspect though that there are probably even better alternatives now in 2025 (I'm running Windows 11).

That can be a great card, however:

- Pinnacle has long-lived models, and those really should have used different model numbers. So there are versions of the "710-USB", with some good, some not so good. (The reason they did not is due to SKU. So, for example, stores like Best Buy will restock SKUs forever, while a new SKU would require new shelf space, possibly new agreements, etc. So same SKU = KISS for them, non-simple for us.)

- Win11 does often currently work fine a the good 710s. Will that change at the next update? It's happened before. This is why offline systems are suggested for video capture. (Not just updates, but "phone home" that can induce dropped frames, glitches, etc.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by WestRGB

To obtain the absolute best possible quality from a VHS tape in 2025, The Domesday Duplicator and VHS-Decode are your best options. However, I would avoid researching those topics on DigitalFAQ -- lots of misinformation on that subject on these forums. Best check out the official Github.

There's no misinformation here. The problem is that the 22-year-old Harry (the "dear leader" of that cult-like project) does not want to read/see/hear anything that would suggest that the project's farts don't smell like roses. There are lots and lots of issues and concerns with it, but head-in-sand is the preference.

Quote:

However, VHS-Decode is not for the faint of heart. If you're a layman without experience soldering or coding, VHS-Decode may be a bridge too far for you. Is it the best? Yeah. But conventional capture methods will still get you 95% to 99% of the way there. It's really a question of how much time, energy, and money you want to pour into your project.

vhs-decode is not best/better, just different. It simply tries to replicate what VCRs did (demodulate the FM signal to video), but it struggles with it. VCRs from 30 years ago can still outperform the method.

Software alone cannot properly decode signals, some % of hardware will be required. I stated that years ago, but was argued/rebuffed. However, time has proven me correct, as they are finally relenting, but it's still not enough. (Of course, they will never admit that.) New, and mature, project leadership is needed.

vhs-decode is not video capturing. Capturing acquires the properly played signal from VCR/camera (and TBCs), it's not trying to recreate anything. Capturing is very WYSIWYG, anybody can do it (and ideally with proper quality equipment) -- while vhs-decode is effectively dismantling a VCR and coding your own software/scripts.

It's a niche hobby project, like tinkering with model rockets. If you like to tear tech/toys/things apart, and dabble with it, then go for it. Have fun. But in terms of serious video capture, it's not that. It'll probably never be that, due to limitations (ROI, costs, time, technical/EE type needs, etc).

Much of the anti-digitalFAQ commentary in the vhs-decode project is solely the ramblings of Harry, a broke unemployed 22-year-old, who's mad that TBCs cost money. Oh, and apparently he hates the term "vaporware", which I used to describe the long-term (10-20 years out) possible trajectory of the project, as it existed about 5 years ago.

[WestRGB]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

There's no misinformation here. The problem is 22-year-old Harry (the "dear leader" of that cult-like project)

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

Much of the anti-digitalFAQ commentary in the vhs-decode project is solely the ramblings of Harry, a broke unemployed 22-year-old

I’ve never heard of this guy, but I’m not really interested in personal attacks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

vhs-decode is not video capturing. Capturing acquires the properly played signal from VCR/camera (and TBCs), it's not trying to recreate anything. Capturing is very WYSIWYG, anybody can do it (and ideally with proper quality equipment) -- while vhs-decode is effectively dismantling a VCR and coding your own software/scripts.

This is basically accurate. You can define “capture” any way you like. But I think for most people, the whole point of the exercise is the destination rather than the journey. In either case, the end result is a high-quality video file that you can play.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

It's a niche hobby project, like tinkering with model rockets. If you like to tear tech/toys/things apart, and dabble with it, then go for it. Have fun.

I would argue that conventional video capture falls into this same category 😉 There’s nothing strictly logical about spending $1000s of dollars on a VHS-Decode setup or a Conventional Capture setup (or in my case, both). We only do it because we want to do it!

Quote:

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

VCRs from 30 years ago can still outperform the method.

No. This is not true today, and will continue to be less true as time goes on.

For anyone reading this, I encourage you to do your own research from multiple sources. Don’t just take my word for it. There are plenty of examples available online.

[lordsmurf]

Quote:

Originally Posted by WestRGB

But I think for most people, the whole point of the exercise is the destination rather than the journey. In either case, the end result is a high-quality video file that you can play.

I would have to disagree. For a vast majority, they enjoy the journey, and the destination (the video) is less important. They just enjoy tinkering, for the thrill of tinkering.
- There are people who love to build computers -- but don't really do much with them.
- There are people that love to fix, customize, and rebuild cars -- but not drive them.
- Many Youtubers love to "review" stuff -- and never actually use it.

That's fine, have fun.

Quote:

We only do it because we want to do it!

Yes, that's really the crux of it. It's not "better" in any way, it's not "the future" as some claim. It's just a model rocket. Proof of concept. It's nifty in the same way that "alternate OS" (SkyOS, etc) are fun to tinker with. "Wow, I did it!" ... and then they often find another challenge. Been there, done that. I've somewhat grown out of it, too many life priorities that are more important (often not fun, time vampires).

Quote:

No. This is not true today, and will continue to be less true as time goes on.
... There are plenty of examples available online.

Halo/ringing is a side effect that makes most vhs-decode output worthless. And there are other common defects, too.

Example footage online is largely not impressive. There are also a lot of misleading samples, that take the cheap garbage capture method (Easycap/Dazzle + thrift store VCR), and then compare it to vhs-decode. As an analogy, I could compare dog food to roadkill, to "prove" which is better. But it doesn't change the fact that neither are edible for human consumption. The problem is when people falsely believe those are the only choices.

I've never had a problem with vhs-decode. It's just the hyperbole and BS that needs to end. Too many fake comparisons, false statements about "conventional" methods.

(Since vhs-decode is just recreating what a VCR does, reading the FM to video, is it really any less "conventional"? VCR did it in hardware, vhs-decode tries to create hardware with software. Like emulation, sort of. It's not like your reading the tape with lasers and AI, or something.)

It's also far more time consuming, and can be equally as costly. Quality VCRs and storage are not cheap!

Software also often cannot recreate everything that hardware does, and it's often the case here -- something most video game emulation fans know quite well.

Again, not better, just different.

It is what is it, and it isn't what it isn't.